Re: HP DL 380 G3 Servers

Discussion in 'Computing' started by terryc, Aug 8, 2009.

  1. terryc

    terryc Guest

    On Sat, 08 Aug 2009 19:08:19 +1000, Marts wrote:

    > Work is disposing of a few of these:
    >
    > http://h18000.www1.hp.com/products/quickspecs/11473_div/11473_div.HTML
    >
    > What do you think? How would one of these go running either as a
    > file/print server or as a "desktop" computer?
    >
    > It might be the solution that I need for a NAS, if I can grab one for
    > nothing.


    Look at component number 5; akq 1" WIDE, huh, I think they mean high

    How many ultra 3 scsi hard drives do you have sitting in your junk bin?

    None?, then forget it. You could be paying anything up to $240+ shipping
    for half a dozen drives of 18Gb each to have 6x18Gb unmirrored/non-raid
    hard disk space.

    They will also whine like a pack of banshees.

    OTOH, if they come fitted out with any of the 300Gb hard disk drives,
    then I'd take whatever I could haul away for nick as well.

    The other alternative I'd would be looking at is to see if you could plug
    an expansion PCI ide(or sata?) hard disk card and what mounting kit you
    need to mount some ide hard disks inside.

    Caveat, the PCI expansion slots are only 100Mhz and not the more modern
    133(?)Mhz cardsthat are common now.







    --

    Great advances in Debian Linux; post a bug report and get spam in three
    days.








    --

    Great advances in Debian Linux; post a bug report and get spam in three
    days.
     
    terryc, Aug 8, 2009
    #1
    1. Advertisements

  2. terryc wrote:
    > On Sat, 08 Aug 2009 19:08:19 +1000, Marts wrote:
    >
    >> Work is disposing of a few of these:
    >>
    >> http://h18000.www1.hp.com/products/quickspecs/11473_div/11473_div.HTML
    >>
    >> What do you think? How would one of these go running either as a
    >> file/print server or as a "desktop" computer?
    >>
    >> It might be the solution that I need for a NAS, if I can grab one for
    >> nothing.

    >
    > Look at component number 5; akq 1" WIDE, huh, I think they mean high
    >
    > How many ultra 3 scsi hard drives do you have sitting in your junk bin?
    >
    > None?, then forget it. You could be paying anything up to $240+ shipping
    > for half a dozen drives of 18Gb each to have 6x18Gb unmirrored/non-raid
    > hard disk space.
    >
    > They will also whine like a pack of banshees.
    >
    > OTOH, if they come fitted out with any of the 300Gb hard disk drives,
    > then I'd take whatever I could haul away for nick as well.
    >
    > The other alternative I'd would be looking at is to see if you could plug
    > an expansion PCI ide(or sata?) hard disk card and what mounting kit you
    > need to mount some ide hard disks inside.
    >
    > Caveat, the PCI expansion slots are only 100Mhz and not the more modern
    > 133(?)Mhz cardsthat are common now.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >


    Have seen other HP towers, it's SCSI or nothing.
    You have no chance in hell of putting a SATA in there.
    If your lucky, HP might have a single IDE connector on board for a CD

    You can pickup new Seagate Cheatah 300GB for just over $700 !!
    But they do spin at 15,000 RPM, so these are really going to howl.
     
    son of a bitch, Aug 9, 2009
    #2
    1. Advertisements

  3. terryc

    terryc Guest

    On Sun, 09 Aug 2009 11:34:36 +1000, son of a bitch wrote:


    >>
    >>

    > Have seen other HP towers, it's SCSI or nothing. You have no chance in
    > hell of putting a SATA in there. If your lucky, HP might have a single
    > IDE connector on board for a CD


    There specs said there were three pci slots in there.
    >
    > You can pickup new Seagate Cheatah 300GB for just over $700 !! But they
    > do spin at 15,000 RPM, so these are really going to howl.


    You don't have to tell me, I've have cheetah stuff from 9Gb up and they
    are all howlers.

    Unless you really need that hard disk I/O speeds there cheaper ways of
    getting the space for the hoi-poloi.





    --

    Great advances in Debian Linux; post a bug report and get spam in three
    days.








    --

    Great advances in Debian Linux; post a bug report and get spam in three
    days.
     
    terryc, Aug 9, 2009
    #3
  4. terryc wrote:
    > On Sun, 09 Aug 2009 11:34:36 +1000, son of a bitch wrote:
    >
    >
    >>>

    >> Have seen other HP towers, it's SCSI or nothing. You have no chance in
    >> hell of putting a SATA in there. If your lucky, HP might have a single
    >> IDE connector on board for a CD

    >
    > There specs said there were three pci slots in there.
    >> You can pickup new Seagate Cheatah 300GB for just over $700 !! But they
    >> do spin at 15,000 RPM, so these are really going to howl.

    >
    > You don't have to tell me, I've have cheetah stuff from 9Gb up and they
    > are all howlers.
    >
    > Unless you really need that hard disk I/O speeds there cheaper ways of
    > getting the space for the hoi-poloi.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >


    My experience with PCI USB2 cards has not been a very pleasing
    experience. Nothing but software driver OS computability problems. So I
    can assume SATA addins will be worse than that.
     
    son of a bitch, Aug 9, 2009
    #4
  5. terryc

    Rod Speed Guest

    son of a bitch wrote:
    > terryc wrote:
    >> On Sun, 09 Aug 2009 11:34:36 +1000, son of a bitch wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>>
    >>> Have seen other HP towers, it's SCSI or nothing. You have no chance
    >>> in hell of putting a SATA in there. If your lucky, HP might have a
    >>> single IDE connector on board for a CD

    >>
    >> There specs said there were three pci slots in there.
    >>> You can pickup new Seagate Cheatah 300GB for just over $700 !! But
    >>> they do spin at 15,000 RPM, so these are really going to howl.

    >>
    >> You don't have to tell me, I've have cheetah stuff from 9Gb up and
    >> they are all howlers.
    >>
    >> Unless you really need that hard disk I/O speeds there cheaper ways
    >> of getting the space for the hoi-poloi.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>

    >
    > My experience with PCI USB2 cards has not been a very pleasing
    > experience. Nothing but software driver OS computability problems. So I can assume SATA addins will be worse than
    > that.


    You cant assume anything of the sort.
     
    Rod Speed, Aug 9, 2009
    #5
  6. terryc

    Rod Speed Guest

    Farts wrote
    > terryc wrote


    >> How many ultra 3 scsi hard drives do you have sitting in your junk bin?


    > Heaps....


    > Er, actually, none.


    > :)


    >> None?, then forget it. You could be paying anything up to $240+
    >> shipping for half a dozen drives of 18Gb each to have 6x18Gb
    >> unmirrored/non-raid hard disk space.


    > 3 of the racks have 2 or 3 70 gig drives installed.


    Pathetic compared with modern 1TB drives, stupid.

    >> They will also whine like a pack of banshees.


    > That wouldn't be an issue. It'd reside out in the shed,
    > once it's built and cabling and trenching is done (soon).


    Still stupidly small.

    >> OTOH, if they come fitted out with any of the 300Gb hard disk
    >> drives, then I'd take whatever I could haul away for nick as well.


    > There's one that has 4 x 300 gig drives and 2 x 70 gig drives (these
    > two have a dymo label with "O/S" on them. So, presumably 140 gig
    > or 70 gig mirrored for the OS and 1,200 gig for storage.


    Still stupid compared with a decent modern 1.5TB drive.

    > So, I put my claim on that one, only to be told that it's a 4G model
    > and that they're keeping it, when I rang the IT guy at home. OK, I
    > said, I better put it back then. Eh? You're not s'posed to grab one
    > til Tuesday when we open the disposal "auction", he shrieked at me
    > over the phone...


    > :)


    > Anyway, I don't think that I'll bother. You guys have made some good
    > points, particularly with respect to hard drive upgrades, costs and so on.


    > If I could get my mitts on all of them I'd raid (pun intended) them
    > all for the hard drives and try and populate one server with as many
    > drives as possible.


    More fool you.

    > I might see if I can score an IBM NetVista desktop that's also available.
    > It might be handy to experiment with Linux or as a cheap file server.
     
    Rod Speed, Aug 9, 2009
    #6
  7. Marts wrote:
    > terryc wrote...
    >
    >> How many ultra 3 scsi hard drives do you have sitting in your junk bin?

    >
    > Heaps....
    >
    > Er, actually, none.
    >
    > :)
    >
    >> None?, then forget it. You could be paying anything up to $240+ shipping
    >> for half a dozen drives of 18Gb each to have 6x18Gb unmirrored/non-raid
    >> hard disk space.

    >
    > 3 of the racks have 2 or 3 70 gig drives installed.
    >
    >> They will also whine like a pack of banshees.

    >
    > That wouldn't be an issue. It'd reside out in the shed, once it's built and
    > cabling and trenching is done (soon).
    >
    >> OTOH, if they come fitted out with any of the 300Gb hard disk drives,
    >> then I'd take whatever I could haul away for nick as well.

    >
    > There's one that has 4 x 300 gig drives and 2 x 70 gig drives (these two have a
    > dymo label with "O/S" on them. So, presumably 140 gig or 70 gig mirrored for the
    > OS and 1,200 gig for storage.
    >
    > So, I put my claim on that one, only to be told that it's a 4G model and that
    > they're keeping it, when I rang the IT guy at home. OK, I said, I better put it
    > back then. Eh? You're not s'posed to grab one til Tuesday when we open the
    > disposal "auction", he shrieked at me over the phone...
    >
    > :)
    >
    > Anyway, I don't think that I'll bother. You guys have made some good points,
    > particularly with respect to hard drive upgrades, costs and so on.
    >
    > If I could get my mitts on all of them I'd raid (pun intended) them all for the
    > hard drives and try and populate one server with as many drives as possible.
    >
    > I might see if I can score an IBM NetVista desktop that's also available. It
    > might be handy to experiment with Linux or as a cheap file server.
    >


    Actually the total usable space will be 3 x 300 + 1 x 70
    So 6 drives is going to give < 1 TB

    The paradox is, the more drives you have, the more chance you have of
    a drive failure. Lucky it's raided, I think your going to need it.

    In all seriousness, you would be better getting an old PC at the Market
    and sticking a couple of 750GB SATAs in as a Mirror. it will be a Shit
    load Quieter and use a Shit load less Power.

    The only real difference, Pay Now or Pay Later
     
    son of a bitch, Aug 9, 2009
    #7
  8. terryc

    terryc Guest

    On Sun, 09 Aug 2009 14:12:22 +1000, son of a bitch wrote:


    >>

    > My experience with PCI USB2 cards has not been a very pleasing
    > experience. Nothing but software driver OS computability problems. So I
    > can assume SATA addins will be worse than that.


    I'm still playing ide pci plug ins. The only problems have been getting
    them recognised under linux with some models.


    --

    Great advances in Debian Linux; post a bug report and get spam in three
    days.
     
    terryc, Aug 9, 2009
    #8
  9. terryc

    terryc Guest

    On Sun, 09 Aug 2009 19:01:19 +1000, Marts wrote:

    > terryc wrote...
    >
    >> How many ultra 3 scsi hard drives do you have sitting in your junk bin?

    >
    > Heaps....
    >
    > Er, actually, none.
    >
    > :)
    >
    >> None?, then forget it. You could be paying anything up to $240+
    >> shipping for half a dozen drives of 18Gb each to have 6x18Gb
    >> unmirrored/non-raid hard disk space.

    >
    > 3 of the racks have 2 or 3 70 gig drives installed.
    >
    >> They will also whine like a pack of banshees.

    >
    > That wouldn't be an issue. It'd reside out in the shed, once it's built
    > and cabling and trenching is done (soon).
    >
    >> OTOH, if they come fitted out with any of the 300Gb hard disk drives,
    >> then I'd take whatever I could haul away for nick as well.

    >
    > There's one that has 4 x 300 gig drives and 2 x 70 gig drives (these two
    > have a dymo label with "O/S" on them. So, presumably 140 gig or 70 gig
    > mirrored for the OS and 1,200 gig for storage.
    >
    > So, I put my claim on that one, only to be told that it's a 4G model and
    > that they're keeping it, when I rang the IT guy at home. OK, I said, I
    > better put it back then. Eh? You're not s'posed to grab one til Tuesday
    > when we open the disposal "auction", he shrieked at me over the phone...


    Why the heck did you tell them? {;-).
    >
    > :)
    >
    > Anyway, I don't think that I'll bother. You guys have made some good
    > points, particularly with respect to hard drive upgrades, costs and so
    > on.
    >
    > If I could get my mitts on all of them I'd raid (pun intended) them all
    > for the hard drives and try and populate one server with as many drives
    > as possible.


    Probably what It intended anyway. I have never received good throwouts
    from any business with an intelligent IT dept. Ratted is the polite-est
    way to describe tose systems.

    --

    Great advances in Debian Linux; post a bug report and get spam in three
    days.








    --

    Great advances in Debian Linux; post a bug report and get spam in three
    days.
     
    terryc, Aug 9, 2009
    #9
  10. Marts wrote:
    > son of a bitch wrote...
    >
    >> Actually the total usable space will be 3 x 300 + 1 x 70
    >> So 6 drives is going to give < 1 TB

    >
    > I've had a rethink. I had another look at them today with the IT Guru present
    > (over the weekend when I looked at them in the storeroom he wasn't there).
    >
    > I have staked my claim on one that has all 6 filled. 2 of them have 146.8 gig
    > drives, the other 4 have 76.8 gig drives. The right two bays (top and bottom)
    > are for the OS, I believe.
    >
    > So, in a RAID config there's about 200 gigs of storage. Or close to 300 gigs if
    > not duplicated. Obviously that'd be far less secure and the total loss of data
    > if one disk fails would be the outcome.
    >
    > And if no-one else stakes their claim to what's left, if i get the one that I
    > wan't, of course, then I'll grab them, remove the drives and dump what's left in
    > the electrical waste bin outside.
    >
    > It'll be something to play with.
    >
    >> The paradox is, the more drives you have, the more chance you have of
    >> a drive failure. Lucky it's raided, I think your going to need it.

    >
    > They have a similar argument over on aus.aviation about what they called ETOPS
    > operation, flying aircraft over water and whether it's safer with 2 engines or 4
    > engines and the argument that there is more likelihood of a 4 engined aircraft
    > suffering an engine failure.
    >
    > Counter to that argument is that you're down to 3 engines or 75% capacity. On
    > the 2 engine aircraft it's down to 1 engine and 50% capacity. Or none if the
    > other one fails...
    >
    > Getting back on topic, how reliable are these 10,000rpm drives? One that I
    > looked at is a Seagate. I assume that they all are, but don't know for sure. I
    > do know that they've been in operation for a long time. I don't know how many
    > are replacements for original drives.
    >
    >
    >> In all seriousness, you would be better getting an old PC at the Market
    >> and sticking a couple of 750GB SATAs in as a Mirror. it will be a Shit
    >> load Quieter and use a Shit load less Power.

    >
    > Valid point.
    >


    These drives were made to run 24/7, so they would be fairly reliable but
    the bearings may get a bit noisy.
     
    son of a bitch, Aug 11, 2009
    #10
  11. terryc

    terryc Guest

    On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 06:56:06 +1000, Marts wrote:


    > Getting back on topic, how reliable are these 10,000rpm drives?


    IME, not very. about 3-5 years.
    >
    >> In all seriousness, you would be better getting an old PC at the Market
    >> and sticking a couple of 750GB SATAs in as a Mirror. it will be a Shit
    >> load Quieter and use a Shit load less Power.


    When it comes down to paying cash to get something old working, this is
    usually the case.

    --

    Great advances in Debian Linux; post a bug report and get spam in three
    days.
     
    terryc, Aug 11, 2009
    #11
  12. terryc

    Rod Speed Guest

    Marts wrote:
    > A got a mate to grab the stuff for me today. I got into work tonight,
    > grabbed the PC, an IBM NetVista with a P4 1.6 gig and 256 megs of RAM
    > and 40 gig HDD. I'll upgrade it to something a bit more substantial
    > with some spares that I have lying around, turn it into a "net top".
    > Basic email, web browsing, etc.
    >
    > As for the servers, the buggers had ratted the 145 gig drives from
    > them, not much left in the rest. So I didn't bother. One of the mates
    > grabbed them, though. He's now got 5 G1 and G2 servers with a
    > smattering of drives in them all.
    >
    > I had a look at the RAM in some of them. Unfortunately, while they're
    > PC133 SDRAM, they're ECC memory so they won't work in the NetVista.
    > And yeah, I tried. All the machine does is repeat 5 beeps on bootup.
    > So I'll use the original memory in it for the time being.


    > Question - how will XP go running on 256 megs?


    Its fine, thats what my laptop is.

    > And what about Office 2003?


    Its fine too.

    > The NetVista originally ran Windows 2000 on it and
    > seemed to do that OK. I'd stick it on but I don't have it.


    > I can't even find my Win98SE disk...
     
    Rod Speed, Aug 12, 2009
    #12
  13. Marts wrote:
    > A got a mate to grab the stuff for me today. I got into work tonight, grabbed
    > the PC, an IBM NetVista with a P4 1.6 gig and 256 megs of RAM and 40 gig HDD.
    > I'll upgrade it to something a bit more substantial with some spares that I have
    > lying around, turn it into a "net top". Basic email, web browsing, etc.
    >
    > As for the servers, the buggers had ratted the 145 gig drives from them, not
    > much left in the rest. So I didn't bother. One of the mates grabbed them,
    > though. He's now got 5 G1 and G2 servers with a smattering of drives in them
    > all.
    >
    > I had a look at the RAM in some of them. Unfortunately, while they're PC133
    > SDRAM, they're ECC memory so they won't work in the NetVista. And yeah, I tried.
    > All the machine does is repeat 5 beeps on bootup. So I'll use the original
    > memory in it for the time being.
    >
    > Question - how will XP go running on 256 megs? And what about Office 2003?
    >
    > The NetVista originally ran Windows 2000 on it and seemed to do that OK. I'd
    > stick it on but I don't have it.
    >
    > I can't even find my Win98SE disk...
    >

    xp, will run on 256meg, but a virus scanner will kill it.
    it will even run on P2's !
    word 2000-2003 use similar memory, don't expect to run anything else though.
     
    son of a bitch, Aug 12, 2009
    #13
  14. terryc

    Rod Speed Guest

    son of a bitch wrote:
    > Marts wrote:
    >> A got a mate to grab the stuff for me today. I got into work
    >> tonight, grabbed the PC, an IBM NetVista with a P4 1.6 gig and 256
    >> megs of RAM and 40 gig HDD. I'll upgrade it to something a bit more
    >> substantial with some spares that I have lying around, turn it into
    >> a "net top". Basic email, web browsing, etc. As for the servers, the buggers had ratted the 145 gig drives from
    >> them, not much left in the rest. So I didn't bother. One of the
    >> mates grabbed them, though. He's now got 5 G1 and G2 servers with a
    >> smattering of drives in them all.
    >>
    >> I had a look at the RAM in some of them. Unfortunately, while
    >> they're PC133 SDRAM, they're ECC memory so they won't work in the
    >> NetVista. And yeah, I tried. All the machine does is repeat 5 beeps
    >> on bootup. So I'll use the original memory in it for the time being.
    >>
    >> Question - how will XP go running on 256 megs? And what about Office
    >> 2003? The NetVista originally ran Windows 2000 on it and seemed to do that
    >> OK. I'd stick it on but I don't have it.
    >>
    >> I can't even find my Win98SE disk...
    >>

    > xp, will run on 256meg, but a virus scanner will kill it.


    Wrong, as always. Doesnt kill my laptop.

    > it will even run on P2's !
    > word 2000-2003 use similar memory, don't expect to run anything else though.


    Wrong, as always. I run Access and Excel and Word simultaneously on my 256K laptop fine.
     
    Rod Speed, Aug 12, 2009
    #14
  15. Marts wrote:
    > son of a bitch wrote...
    >
    >> xp, will run on 256meg, but a virus scanner will kill it.
    >> it will even run on P2's !
    >> word 2000-2003 use similar memory, don't expect to run anything else though.

    >
    > I have it up and running. XP SP1 and Office 03 so far installed. Seems to be
    > doing OK. I opened Outlook, Internet Explorer and Excel.
    >
    > Task Manager said that I still have 120 megs free RAM and CPU use was around 1%.
    >
    > I forget the pagefile useage value.
    >
    > Whatever, seems to be OK, so far.
    >
    > This PC, like the rest in the "fleet" at work at the time ran Win2K and Office
    > 97 amongst other apps and some industry specific ones. They served us fairly
    > well for a few years.
    >
    > I'll see if I can source a gig of PC133 memory for it and I have an 80 gig drive
    > ready to throw into it.
    >
    > It'll do for a "net pc" for a while.
    >
    > Just having some network issues with it at the moment. See my next post for more
    > info.


    PC133 is really really really old, I think the Avg Max Cap of that
    vintage is 256 or 512 Meg.
    And Drive Cap is another > 80gig will be a problem, if my memory serves.
     
    son of a bitch, Aug 12, 2009
    #15
  16. terryc

    Rod Speed Guest

    son of a bitch wrote:
    > Marts wrote:
    >> son of a bitch wrote...
    >>
    >>> xp, will run on 256meg, but a virus scanner will kill it.
    >>> it will even run on P2's !
    >>> word 2000-2003 use similar memory, don't expect to run anything
    >>> else though.

    >>
    >> I have it up and running. XP SP1 and Office 03 so far installed.
    >> Seems to be doing OK. I opened Outlook, Internet Explorer and Excel.
    >>
    >> Task Manager said that I still have 120 megs free RAM and CPU use
    >> was around 1%. I forget the pagefile useage value.
    >>
    >> Whatever, seems to be OK, so far.
    >>
    >> This PC, like the rest in the "fleet" at work at the time ran Win2K
    >> and Office 97 amongst other apps and some industry specific ones.
    >> They served us fairly well for a few years.
    >>
    >> I'll see if I can source a gig of PC133 memory for it and I have an
    >> 80 gig drive ready to throw into it.
    >>
    >> It'll do for a "net pc" for a while.
    >>
    >> Just having some network issues with it at the moment. See my next
    >> post for more info.

    >
    > PC133 is really really really old, I think the Avg Max Cap of that
    > vintage is 256 or 512 Meg.
    > And Drive Cap is another > 80gig will be a problem, if my memory serves.


    It doesnt, as always.
     
    Rod Speed, Aug 12, 2009
    #16
    1. Advertisements

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. son of a bitch

    Re: HP DL 380 G3 Servers

    son of a bitch, Aug 8, 2009, in forum: Computing
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    256
    son of a bitch
    Aug 8, 2009
  2. Andy

    Re: HP DL 380 G3 Servers

    Andy, Aug 9, 2009, in forum: Computing
    Replies:
    4
    Views:
    441
    Rod Speed
    Aug 12, 2009
  3. Dyna  Soar

    Re: HP DL 380 G3 Servers

    Dyna Soar, Aug 15, 2009, in forum: Computing
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    230
    Dyna Soar
    Aug 15, 2009
  4. terryc

    Re: HP DL 380 G3 Servers

    terryc, Aug 15, 2009, in forum: Computing
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    398
    terryc
    Aug 16, 2009
Loading...

Share This Page